Re: Infodumps in erotic romance I'm new to erotic romance and still learning the conventions of the genre. One convention in particular puzzles me. Nine out of ten of the erotic romance ebooks I see start with an infodump--"As Marie scanned the men lined up at the bar, she wondered whether one of them would be the One. Ever since becoming Grand Exalted Poobah of the local werewolf tribes, no fellow werewolf had dared to take her on, and even human men avoided her, warned away by the faint aura of power she exuded. Incidentally, she grew up in Cincinnati and spent three years trekking the foorhills of India before settling in Duluth, where she met the werewolf lord who bit her. But let's go back to the studs at the bar. Don't worry, you'll get to know all about the werewolf lord in a chapter and a half."
Is this because readers want to get the background over with as quickly as possible and get on to the romance? Do readers actually expect and prefer this kind of beginning? Or is it a quality control and sampling issue? I'm not trying to be snarky or judgemental, I really do want to understand what the market likes.
This isn't a "convention," it's a mark of the author's limited awareness, effort, or skill. It also says a lot about the abilities of the editting staff.
Bayou Bill- 07-30-2007
Vincent,
In my (very) humble opinion, your advice is only brilliant--well, okay, it's also pithy.
For me, an info dump is any concentration of information that I notice. As a writer, I may be more sensitive to them than "normal" folks, but that's a hazard of our trade.
Bayou Bill 8)
kmfrontain- 07-30-2007
It depends so much on the story, too. A second book often has small infodumps referring back to the previous story, but readers might not mind because, well, they bought the second book because they're revisiting favourite characters.
I suppose it depends on where and how much you dump. Some manure is good for the flowers. Some not. ;-)
Kate Willoughby- 09-29-2007
I like a story that starts fast, don't get me wrong. But one reason you might see this immediate blast of background info is that the author only has limited amount of words to tell the whole story. I've had the challenge several times of a 12K limit. That short of a word count doesn't give you much wiggle room. You haven't the luxury of lazily doling out backstory like appetizers.
Also, in my opinion, one paragraph doesn't qualify as an info dump. Sheesh, I remember the days when a novel would take three chapters to really begin.
cupnjava- 09-29-2007
I like a story that starts fast, don't get me wrong. But one reason you might see this immediate blast of background info is that the author only has limited amount of words to tell the whole story. I've had the challenge several times of a 12K limit. That short of a word count doesn't give you much wiggle room. You haven't the luxury of lazily doling out backstory like appetizers.
Also, in my opinion, one paragraph doesn't qualify as an info dump. Sheesh, I remember the days when a novel would take three chapters to really begin.
Word count limits are part of it, but not in ebooks unless you're getting close to the 90k mark. And if you've crammed so much story into an ebook that you need to rush backstory, then you're hammering two stories into one book.
veinglory- 09-29-2007
I still think it is a stylistic choice. I have several 10k stories in fantasy worlds but focus on telling the reader what they need to know when they need to know it. One sentence here, one there, and a lot of implicit stuff. I am of the opinion that 'world' is plot's bitch. ;)
Marguerite Mingorance- 09-30-2007
I've read books from both camps. When I was younger I didn't pay much attention, but as I study writing more, I notice things more. Even without looking for it, info dumping now stands out like a sore thumb to me, it's really disruptive, I find myself starting to skim, in order to get back to the actual story.
cupnjava- 09-30-2007
I've read books from both camps. When I was younger I didn't pay much attention, but as I study writing more, I notice things more. Even without looking for it, info dumping now stands out like a sore thumb to me, it's really disruptive, I find myself starting to skim, in order to get back to the actual story.
Yep. Learning about writing has killed some books that I once enjoyed.
kmfrontain- 09-30-2007
Yeah, that's true for me as well, but sometimes you can't get away from a minor info dump. I say minor, because most info dumps should fit in with story progression.
Did you all notice most of the Harry Potter novels had info dumps in the first chapters, recapping Harry's pitiable life? I think the author could have skipped some of them, but given that she wrote for a supposedly younger audience, perhaps not.
Lieren- 09-30-2007
They were perfect for my son, who started reading them when he was almost 8 and still enjoys them.
cupnjava- 09-30-2007
Yeah, that's true for me as well, but sometimes you can't get away from a minor info dump. I say minor, because most info dumps should fit in with story progression.
Did you all notice most of the Harry Potter novels had info dumps in the first chapters, recapping Harry's pitiable life? I think the author could have skipped some of them, but given that she wrote for a supposedly younger audience, perhaps not.
You might have a point there. I wonder if YA stuff needs things like infodumps?
veinglory- 09-30-2007
I still read YA (like Tamora Pierce) and find it as variable as any other type in most qualities except language complexity and "adult" material.
kmfrontain- 10-01-2007
Maybe it's a series thing. You write a series, you sometimes have to do a dump in some novels to get past the old and on with the new.
I'm redoing The Gryphon Taint to republish it as a second edition. I wrote the first four chapters a good twelve years ago. Older style, info dumps, but it's the third book in a series, each book over 100k. There's a lot of information in each book.
I had a massive info dump at the beginning of chapter two because I didn't want to spend chapters showing how abused my main girl character was and work in the details, bit by bit, as to why she was abused. I wanted get the basics in and go straight to her last days on a farm and get on with the main plot. I still ended up with nearly three pages of scene setting and info dumping. I can't see how to edit more of the dump out without making readers "look around corners" as I think someone said up in another thread. It's either info dump a little at the beginning, or worry that readers will stop suspending disbelief when I land her in jail awaiting trial for witchcraft. I'm hoping by the time readers get to that book in the series, they'll forgive me for the three pages.
kmfrontain- 10-01-2007
Actually, I'm hoping they'll forgive me for the first three chapters. I really changed my style since then. I was doing a Tolkien thing. Could smack my head now.
cupnjava- 10-01-2007
Actually, I'm hoping they'll forgive me for the first three chapters. I really changed my style since then. I was doing a Tolkien thing. Could smack my head now.
I'm sure your readers will forgive you some creative exploration.
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