I put up entire novels because I have a series to sell, not a single novella or novel. So I figured that it was best to put up an entire novel rather than a chapter to convince readers that I can string a story along for many novels and keep it interesting. So far, when I get a reader into both fantasy and slash fiction, I hook them. But it's a very narrow market. Not everyone is into fantasy to begin with, and then the slash aspect puts a lot of people off that have difficulties with certain sexual freedoms.

I would imagine as an author you're in the minority, in having so many books completed that you can give away an entire novel as it represents only a small proportion of your output. Or do most members here have entire series completed? ::HH's ego shrinks from small to infinitesimal:: But erotica markets are growing by leaps and bounds, yes? And so many of them nowadays seem to accept -- even encourage -- fantasy. That bodes well, I should think.

I hope so. I really do. AFter the success of the LOTR movie, I'm rooting for a return of elf fiction, but not necessarily in the typical Tolkien style, or the Dungeons and Dragons style either. I never believed that market was dead, although I did have one publisher insist on it. Wanted me to rename my elves something else, hide the fact they were elves. Wouldn't do it. Heh heh. It felt a bit too hypocritical to me, to pretend everything was something other than what it was. Elves were whatsits, and dwarves were whosits, wizards were buggeritalls, and great strapping warriors were... great strapping warriors. Warriors were still allowed, now that I recall. ;-) And I hope the erotica market is growing, and that this includes the GLBT aspect of it, in the long run. Speaking of which, I read a gay fiction piece in a Penthouse magazine in their letters to the magazine section way back over 25 years ago. Can you believe that? It was gay! Out and out gay on Penthouse. It was hot, btw, but I'm surprised Penthouse had it. I wonder if I should start another thread to see if anyone else saw gay letters to Penthouse like I did? (And please give your ego a hug. )

"Or do most members here have entire series completed?" Completed? Heck, no. But I'm (counts on fingers) twelve novelettes/novellas into my Eternal Dungeon series, which works out to two-and-a-half novels. I've discovered that my natural writing length is a novella, so now I plan novels as multi-novella series. "Alternatively, do you (or anyone else here) find it useful to put up the first chapter of each of your published books so that it's available for free on a download site or your website?" As a reader, I simply wouldn't buy a book unless I could sample it first. The problem I usually find is that one chapter isn't enough to draw me in. This is partly because I'm a novel- and novella-reader by nature. Short fiction (which is what a single chapter is) just doesn't interest me. The sample has to be long for me to be interested in it. I gather that this is true of some other readers as well. The best teaser I ever encountered was at MAS-Zine. I'm chintzy by nature, and I had no intention of buying the first issue of that magazine (which consisted of a novel and a novella). But the wily editor put online a full one-quarter of the novel. With that much of an excerpt available, I was willing to plunge in. By the time I got to the end of the sample, I was so absorbed in the characters' fortunes that I immediately bought the magazine to find out what happened next. Another alternative, if an author is promoting a novel, is to offer free short fiction that's related to it. People will be more likely to read the story if they know that the ending is available for free, but they'll become absorbed in the characters or setting and want to read more. The third alternative is the one that kmfrontain has taken - offering the first volume of the series for free. What I've heard over and over is that Baen Books (the major SF/F publisher) has been extremely successful in doing this. It has a free online library, mainly consisting of the first volume in series, and apparently, in all or nearly all of the cases, putting the first novel online caused readers to buy the later novels in the series. Me, I'm taking yet more radical a step. Like Cory Doctorow (a science fiction writer), I've decided to put *all* of my fiction online, though I'll serialize the chapters of novels I've just published. It's a gamble, but I think it's a gamble worth taking if you're a relatively unknown self-published author. If I saw a promotion saying, "Rebirth, a novel in print by Author I've Never Heard Of . . ." I wouldn't bother to search out the book, no matter how good the summary sounded. But if I saw a promotion saying, "Rebirth, a novel free online and in print . . ." then I'd check it out. And if I preferred my fiction in hard copy, I'd end up buying the book, or perhaps I'd recommend the book to someone who only read printed fiction, not online fiction. I think that, at this stage in my career, free advertising is more important to me than demanding that all readers pay for my work. (A moment of honesty: What matters to me most is getting readers. If I have to sacrifice money for that, I'm willing to do it. But I think there's a good chance I can get both.)

Ah, there. She said it. "What matters to me most is getting readers." Hence the free novel. I think an entire novel suits the times. The internet is huge and it's the biggest library out there.

As a reader, I simply wouldn't buy a book unless I could sample it first. I think this is a valid issue for both print and e-book readers. In a bookstore, I'll browse through a book for anywhere from 30 seconds to several mintues before deciding to buy. In an online purchase situation, I expect to be able to browse at least part of the book/antho so that I can have a sense of the story, the prose quality, and the conflict. Giving readers a short sample seems only fair and sensible. The best teaser I ever encountered was at MAS-Zine. I'm chintzy by nature, and I had no intention of buying the first issue of that magazine (which consisted of a novel and a novella). But the wily editor put online a full one-quarter of the novel. With that much of an excerpt available, I was willing to plunge in. By the time I got to the end of the sample, I was so absorbed in the characters' fortunes that I immediately bought the magazine to find out what happened next. It's good to know that partial posting can work as a marketing tool. I've got full chapters of both of my mainstream novels up on my main website and lots of short story excerpts for the Vincent Diamond site. Alas, there's no way for me to tell if excerpt readers have clicked on the purchase links to take them to the print pubs where the stories are available. Another alternative, if an author is promoting a novel, is to offer free short fiction that's related to it. People will be more likely to read the story if they know that the ending is available for free, but they'll become absorbed in the characters or setting and want to read more. I've chatted with another gay erotica author about this, specifically the Amazon Shorts program. His take on it was it's an okay marketing tool but don't send 'em your best stuff or anything that you want to resell later. He's not sure that it works for him and he said there's definitely virtually NO money in it despite their 60/40 royalty split. So, I have to take that into account if/when I decide to follow through on this. As an unpublished novel author, I can still post a short story set in my universe but at this point in time, it's not going to lead to sales because the book isn't available for sale yet. But still a great suggestion for later. Me, I'm taking yet more radical a step. Like Cory Doctorow (a science fiction writer), I've decided to put *all* of my fiction online, though I'll serialize the chapters of novels I've just published. ... deleted I think that, at this stage in my career, free advertising is more important to me than demanding that all readers pay for my work. (A moment of honesty: What matters to me most is getting readers. If I have to sacrifice money for that, I'm willing to do it. But I think there's a good chance I can get both.) And that's a viable option for many writers. I think what's great about all these suggestions and ideas is that writers can pick and choose which techniques to try. And the whole tone of the thread is helpful, unlike another writer's forum I frequent where Mr. Uber Self-Marketer comes on like King Kong and slams anyone else's way of doing things. For me, as time goes on, and I do have more available online, I may use more of these ideas for promotion. Thanks to everyone for the great suggestions!

"where Mr. Uber Self-Marketer comes on like King Kong and slams anyone else's way of doing things." :). Yes, I visited a self-publishing e-mail list where most of the posts turned out to be along the lines of, "You idiot! You went to Lulu Press! That's vanity publishing!" Mind you, it was an interesting list, and I learned a lot from it. But I prefer a forum where people are appreciative of variety rather than trying to make everyone conform to a single image.

kmfrontain said: "It felt a bit too hypocritical to me, to pretend everything was something other than what it was. Elves were whatsits, and dwarves were whosits, wizards were buggeritalls, and ..." But think of the slash you could write if wizards <i>were</i> the kind to bugger it all! :-)

Thanks, all, for the great input. I've realised that this discussion probably belongs in promotion rather than self publishing, since all the techniques and ideas you're tossing in are applicable to all forms of publishing, so I'll move it up there.

Wizards are most definitely bugger it alls. :twisted:

Everyone I ever played was. So was every elf, warrior....

I have one book with lulu. 6x9. 307 pages. Contemporary romantic suspense. My price is 13.00. I make $1.75 per book. I never did go with the year at Amazon, because it shot the price up so high. Maybe I should... Sage

Yeah, it shoots it up quite a bit. If you want to keep your same royalty, you need augment the price to account for Amazon's cut. In my case, I lowered my royalty to keep the print book in the same range as the other books. Doesn't matter much. I'm still selling mostly ebooks. This is why I was thinking it might be worth buying the global distribution, just to get my book into the market place globally as a print book, because the Lulu shipping sucks for single book purchases when shipping crosses the US border anywhere.

I have mine set so I make same royalty on print as e-book. So when I sell one on lulu, I never know which sells. I figured if I shot the price up, it would't sell on Amazon. Sage

Yeah, I get the same royalty on Lulu whether it's print or ebook, but I priced considerably higher because a large novel is undervalued as an ebook at lower prices. If I'd known better in the beginning, I would have made entirely separate print versions from ebook versions, so that the royalties were adjusted down for print, but up for ebooks to get the proper value. I would like to give my print customers a better deal, but I'm stuck with those versions in print now, and though Lulu staff tells me that anyone who bought the ebook will still have access even if I take the ebook version off that particular book, I'm afraid to try it yet. I need a customer willing to -*test*-('") the ebook download after I do something like that. Actually. That's an idea. I may make a plea on LJ for a customer to -*test*-('") the validity of this claim, that past buyers will still have access to the ebook even if I make it unavailable now.